Da Election!

[norsenerd]

*sets Felix's integra on fire*<br><br>Hehehe<br><br>*climbs a tree*

[Zylo]

Ok, I'm gonna throw my 2 cents worth into this...<br><br>Just a note to darkdragon: no offense, but it seems pretty clear that you're view of world events is limited to what your parents have told you. You're only 13, and that's pretty common; when I was 13, I didn't form my own opinions either. I suggest that you do some independent research into events and approach things with an open mind. Don't be afraid to question what you hear. Get news from a variety of sources and look for slants and biases in the media. You'd be amazed what you'll see. And if you disagree with popular opinion or what people tell you is right, you need to be able to back up your argument. And please try to clean up your spelling and grammar, it makes communication a lot easier.<br><br>Anyway, moving on to the topic:<br><br>I'm pretty middle-of-the-road as far as where I lean politically, although I do lean a little to the right ::prepares for lynch mob:: I'm not happy with Bush, though; he's destroying the party (and the nation).<br><br>His domestic policy sucks. The economy is in the toilet, and he's not taking the steps necissary to get it back up. Given the mass deficits, we can't afford tax cuts. Although the logic seems right (increase the money supply, the spending will go up and the economy will recover), it's obvious that they aren't achieving their intended effect. Right now, we need to bite the bullet and raise taxes to help close the deficit; we need to restore our credit. Job creation isn't going the way it needs to, either. Obviously, success can't be achieved in leaps and bounds, but it should be made faster than what it is now.<br><br>Now for Iraq. I'm not gonna argue about the nature of the nation before we were in there or the nature of Saddam. That he was a brutal dictator was inarguable, and yes, we are better off without him in power. Right now, we're in Iraq, so it's a moot point to argue whether or not we belong there. We're there, we gotta deal. Bush simply hasn't shown the leadership needed to effectively rebuild Iraq. Being that I don't know much in military strategy or nation-building, I can't say exactly what is needed, but it is obvious that Bush isn't going to handle the situation properly. Honestly, it seems like more troops are needed right now, sadly. We're not maintaining the control needed, and decreasing our presence there will just make Iraq a lost cause. On the other hand, there's the fear of this escalating into a Vietnam-like situation. We need someone who can effectively lead and manage a military campaign. Bush isn't that person, but I don't think Kerry is that person, either.<br><br>I don't think Kerry will be a great president, but I think our country needs Bush out. Our country and two-party system does have its avantages. If we had all Republicans for a long time, our economy would expand and we'd develop decent wealth, but the common man would be degraded. On the other hand, a long string of Democrats would serve a populist cause and help the common man, but the national economy and foreign policy would be neglected. It's the cycling of the two ideals that let the nation develop. Right now, there's a need for a liberal term to balance the conservative's actions, but I'm not sure if Kerry's the best person to lead that term. Well, come November, we'll see how this ends up...

[Sakie]

<br><!--QuoteBegin--> <table border='0' align='center' width='95%' ><tr><td class='quotetop'><b>Quote:</b> </td></tr><tr><td class='quotebody'> I'm sorry but having so litle punctuation and grammar this paragraph is unreadable. What i got was that this war has had the least deaths in almost any American war. That's a strange analysis. What do you base it on? Lenght of time they've fought? Geographical situations? Enemy intelligence, tactics, numbers? Effective military? All these factors will be very different for every war, i think it is foolish to compare deaths when that's the case.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table> <!--QuoteEEnd--> dude i had to write it fast i was supposted to be doing my chores edit:ok i fixed the paragraph are you all happy?<br><br><br><br><br>

[Sakie]

<!--QuoteBegin--> <table border='0' align='center' width='95%' ><tr><td class='quotetop'><b>Quote:</b> </td></tr><tr><td class='quotebody'> 'm not going to waste anymore rant energy on DarkDragon, simply because I see no virtue in debating with someone no older than my little sister (and obviously no more mature). No offense, DD, but I suggest you broaden your world view before engaging debates like this. I myself supported Bush when I was 13, but that was before I know what the Republican party stood for. At that age, my political views were the same as those of my parents, and I've yet to see anyone under 15 who had the sort of knowledge/experience necessary to support a candidate based on the real issues. Your claim that our economy is the best it's ever been is direct evidence of this, combined with the blanket statements like your claim of Clinton being a horrible president.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I said i did not want to get i a debate about this, I am a replublican and my views on this type of stuff are way diffrent from my parents. Oh let me tell you we my mom is a democrat my dad is a republican i heard both there views on things. and sure i am young so?? are you saying my views on things dont count just because i am 13?.And everyone hates clinto even the democrats<br><!--QuoteBegin--> <table border='0' align='center' width='95%' ><tr><td class='quotetop'><b>Quote:</b> </td></tr><tr><td class='quotebody'> Oh, and please learn how to type better. If you're intelligent enough to comprehend O&M, you really should be able to use basic punctuation and capitalization.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table> <!--QuoteEEnd--><br>Ok buddy I was in a hurry i had to clean the house sure i dont wast my time trying to make a perfect paragraph. MABY SCHOOLS OUT AND I DONT WANT TO TYPE LONG ESSAYS ANYMORE?????? <!--QuoteBegin--> <table border='0' align='center' width='95%' ><tr><td class='quotetop'><b>Quote:</b> </td></tr><tr><td class='quotebody'> I'm not going to waste anymore rant energy on DarkDragon, simply because I see no virtue in debating with someone no older than my little sister (and obviously no more mature). <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table> <!--QuoteEEnd--> come on now... dude sometimes i think I act more mature than you man.

[Salad Man]

<!--QuoteBegin-darkdragon+May 20 2004, 07:14 PM--> <table border='0' align='center' width='95%' ><tr><td class='quotetop'><b>Quote:</b> (darkdragon @ May 20 2004, 07:14 PM)</td></tr><tr><td class='quotebody'> <!--QuoteBegin--> <table border='0' align='center' width='95%' ><tr><td class='quotetop'><b>Quote:</b> </td></tr><tr><td class='quotebody'> Oh, and please learn how to type better. If you're intelligent enough to comprehend O&M, you really should be able to use basic punctuation and capitalization.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table> <!--QuoteEEnd--><br>Ok buddy I was in a hurry i had to clean the house sure i dont wast my time trying to make a perfect paragraph. MABY SCHOOLS OUT AND I DONT WANT TO TYPE LONG ESSAYS ANYMORE??????<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table> <!--QuoteEEnd--><br>Really, how hard is it to move your finger over to the period/exclamation point/question mark key at the end of each sentance? And the shift key at the begining of each? As for spelling, just run your post through a word processor with a spellchecker (or, lacking that, run a Google search on any questionable words will work) if you don't feel like looking your post over.<br><br>Oh, and for the record, Clinton was awesome.<br><br>EDIT: And whoever voted for "Who cares?" is an asshat.

[Dr. Dos]

I'm only 15, while it's true at 13 i didn't pay even the slightest attention to politics, I don't see why dragon can't be different.<br><br>Looking back trying to find the quote where somebody called dragon immature I did notice him saying that Clinton was a bad president. I will say I doubt at around 10 that you'd really know anything about Clinton and his policies (I know I don't.) All I know is that people made a big deal about the whole Monica Lewinski thing, which I think should've only really been a problem with Bill and Hilary, seeing as how a president's current relationship with his wife has nothing to do with how he's handling the country.<br><br>Ah, here it is:<br><br><img src='http://www.allhatnocattle.net/bush_deficit_graphic.gif' border='0' alt='user posted image' /><br>

[Henohenomoheji]

I think we were trying to avoid arguements in this board. Could we please be rational. If you're gonna fight, do it in IRC <!--emo&:P--><img src='http://definecynical.mancubus.net/forum ... tongue.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tongue.gif' /><!--endemo-->. that way people who don't go there much won't be annoying and interupt <!--emo&:P--><img src='http://definecynical.mancubus.net/forum ... tongue.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tongue.gif' /><!--endemo-->.<br><br>Ah, the evils of politics... the solution for world peace is not gonna be easy... [/understatement]<br><br>Please inform me if this post has annoyed you in any way, aside from interupting a "perfectly good" arguement.

[Sakie]

yes i did get way to out of hand we should all get along sorry

[Dr. Dos]

All we are saying, is give peace a chance.

[IceWolfx12]

I chose other, and by other, I wanna let you all know that I mean a monkey, even though he'd be a tough competitor for Kerry...

[Supersmoke]

I'll try to excerpt something from a comedian I heard not too long ago.<br><br>"Clinton was a good president. He was like the cool subsitute teacher you get at elementary school. See, you had Bush, then Clinton, then Bush came back. Clinton was cool."<br><br>I agree. Clinton was better for the economy. So what if he got funky with his secretary. At least he didn't declare war and totally **** up our economy. If Bush reigns over the country again, we either need an assasination or we're gonna get screwed over.<br><br><br><br><br>Regarding the war(s), it wasn't a matter of will we go after the Taliban, it was a matter of HOW we were going after them. 9/11 wasn't a forgiveable ordeal. They actually did something to us. What did Iraq do? Nothing. Der. Why did we go to war with Iraq? Bush is a bush.<br><br>I'm gonna start a conspiracy thread. I've got soem conspiracies on this subject.

[Henohenomoheji]

like the "Zero year curse"?

[Dr. Dos]

The last president survived the Zero Factor. I assume Bush did by cheating death while eating his pretzel.

[norsenerd]

I disagree with George W Bush and would rahter him not be president. On the other had I think that if Kery wins the election the conservitives will still run the United STates. I base this off of the campaing so far and the record of the Democrats in the Senate the past 4 years. Soem of my biggest grevinces are the fact that Bush's tax cuts got 60 votes which ment that democrats gave it enough suport (even if iwas tacit suport) for it to be a give away, that the No Child LEft Behind act got such broad bi-partisin suport dispite beign the awfull piece of legislation that it was, and the fact that George W Bush gut a much borader resolution going into Iraq then Geroge H W Bush got. There have been several other instances when I swish the Democrats put political presure on the conrevities in power but didn;t. Tehy may have had a minority but they coudl have forced compromise a lto and they didn;t.<br><br>Given the record I cannot trust the Democrats to reverse what Bush has done. They will bow to the political preasue controled by the conservitives in this nation. Waht the Kerry campaign has doen in the election further confirms my view. I didn;t make my deciison not to suport Kerry until I heard him make his acceptance speach at the DNCC. I dicided there that he is goign to do nothing but political pandering and viewign the record this is somethign that isn;t good.<br><br>I instead look to the role that third parties have played in our history. Third party canidates may not may have little chance of beign elected to office (and none for president) but they have had a great efect on our politics throught the entire history of our nation. When third parties have goeten enough suprot one of the major parties moved to undermine that suport.<br><br>They serve as a check on our political parites. Without then both parties weill move closer and close together before they are vurtuly indistingushable. That happened in the late 19th century adn during that time animosity for third parties and people who suport them leed tot eh populest revolt. This is a party that forcefully tyook over the Kansas legislature (may be Nebraska but I think it's Kansas) and inplemented such refores and intietive, referendum, and recal, remr limits, and direct election of Senitors. I woudl prefer top live with a more responsable Sneate, with Arnold Swarsenage not beting the govonor of California, and in a third Clinton term.<br><br>In fact a lopt of the msot drastic measurres implemented by the major parties were origionaly sugestion by third parites. The democratic platform in 192 barowed heavily form the Socialist party platfor for example. If you want a mroe modern example of this I give you the Republican party int he 90's. In 1992 and 1996 Ross Perot took large enoguh suport form the conservitive comunity to have a major impact on those electios. Part of the blame for the masive conservitivism of the republican party lies with him (figures liek Regan and Gingrich still have a major efect). Liberals can do the same for the democratic party.<br><br>I give you soemehtign else to think about. If Kerry wins the election Bush won;t be in office but if Bush wins the election and the tradition goign back 50 years continues then Dick Cheny will be running for president. I tell you then every day I call Cheny preisedent is one I will live in fear.<br><br>Any voter has more then two options goign into a presidental campaign. They have the two major party option presented them today or meny options for 4 years down the road. My decision to suprot a third party liberal canidate is to suprot a more liberal choise 4 years down the road and for a more liberal democratic party.<br><br>I loked at the Socalest part, at the Green pary, amnd at Ralh Nader. Of those optiosn for various reasons I decided to suport NAder. I will be casting my vote for NAder in the 2004 presidental election campaing, if he;s ont eh ballot in Virginia.<br><br>The Socalest part is much too out of touch with the realities of modern America and the Green PArty look good but they suport reperatios for African-Americans and I cna;t find anythign that states that NAder suports such reperations. I agree with Nader on a lto of the issues and after researching his campaing I decided that he was the right option for me.

[Ozymandias]

Im from the UK and I would not vote anyone. Seriously. My mum offered me her vote and i didnt want it.