"one nation, under God"

[norsenerd]

<!--QuoteBegin-Sky+Jul 6 2004, 11:12 PM--> <table border='0' align='center' width='95%' ><tr><td class='quotetop'><b>Quote:</b> (Sky @ Jul 6 2004, 11:12 PM)</td></tr><tr><td class='quotebody'> In this particular issue, I believe that a compromise is the best solution.<br><br>I think they should keep "under God" in. And schools should say the pledge at the beginning of the day. (This keeps one side happy)<br><br>But the individual should have the choice of whether to recite it or not. (This keeps the other side happy) <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table> <!--QuoteEEnd--><br> It's not about "under God" it's about impresing peopel to aledge allegance to the state.<br><br><!--QuoteBegin-Decloration of Independance+July 4th, 1774--> <table border='0' align='center' width='95%' ><tr><td class='quotetop'><b>Quote:</b> (Decloration of Independance @ July 4th, 1774)</td></tr><tr><td class='quotebody'> We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. --That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government,<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table> <!--QuoteEEnd--><br><br><!--QuoteBegin-Decloration of Independance+July 4th, 1774--> <table border='0' align='center' width='95%' ><tr><td class='quotetop'><b>Quote:</b> (Decloration of Independance @ July 4th, 1774)</td></tr><tr><td class='quotebody'> But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table> <!--QuoteEEnd--><br><br>As Americans we are honor boudn to question our gevernment and if things come to it overthrow it and establish a new one. I hate it when I break a pledge and I regret being forced to make one wihtout knowing wha tI was talking about. I like our goevernment and falow it in all good faith, which is somethign that not everybody here does, but I reserve the right to question and posable rebel agaisnt the United States if it comes to that. That is the most sacred right of beign an American and the pledge serves to take that away.

[Tavis]

Being loyal to the United States of America does NOT, repeat DOES NOT mean being loyal to the people running our current government without question. It is about being loyal to the systems we have that put those people in power and the methods we have for replacing those people. This system works, and I have faith in it as a citizen of the United States.<br><br>If I felt that the government was not adequately doing its job, I would communicate my issues using the proper channels rather than trying to abolish the government through some anarchist revolt. People can be replaced in elections; replacing a government requires a constitution, recognition by other countries, a system supported by its people, laws, a means of enforcing those laws, and a means of adjusting those laws in a fair manner, among a slew of other things, making it no easy task by any measure.<br><br>I can't tell for sure what you meant by overthrowing the government, but if you mean destroying the existing checks and balances, the constitution, and everything else that put this government in power, expect resistance from those who pledge allegience.<br><br>Indeed, the possibility of the government being entirely corrupted may exist, but it is the reins we have that limit the governement and keep this situation from happening. It is constant vigilance, not a second revolution that will keep us from becoming a failed country.

[norsenerd]

Maybe you shoudl read the Decloration of Independance. I agree that the answer si nto to overtrow the government when otehr means can be sought out, like elections and petitions. What do you do if those have failed, however? Maybe you think we shoudl have stuck with the Articles of Confederation as not to ablosish the curent governemnt. I don;t.<br><br>Still the popint remains, which you ahvnlt touched. The United States should not put preasure to take away the very right this nation was founded upon. It's sick and desgusting.

[Tavis]

If it were proven that the government is a total failure, and it does deprive its people of the rights it promises, something's gotta give. But that would be a difficult thing to accomplish. Now, what rights do you feel pressured to deprive? Life? Liberty? The pursuit of happiness? You might consider me rather optimistic in this matter, but voicing those concerns and being aware of any threats to them are good steps toward maintaining those rights.

[norsenerd]

I feal preasured of the right to question my government.

[FredFlash]

I am starting a petition to request Congress to tell us which God we are under. Who will join me?

[Joe3210]

I am starting a petition to request Congress to tell us which God we are under. Who will join me?

Raises hand.

[FredFlash]

I am starting a petition to request Congress to tell us which God we are under. Who will join me?

Raises hand.

I also want to know if we owe this God any other duties other than to "trust in him" as we are advised to do on the nation's coins.

FF

[Niko123000]

Atheist here.

[FredFlash]

Atheist here.

You're a theist? Which God do you acknowledge?

[Niko123000]

none. God doesn't exist. Only Angels and Demons do. there is no god and devil. We become angels or Demons when we die, not rising to a heaven or going down to hell. we continue to live on earth, Seeing other angels and demons.

[Tum0spoo]

none. God doesn't exist. Only Angels and Demons do. there is no god and devil. We become angels or Demons when we die, not rising to a heaven or going down to hell. we continue to live on earth, Seeing other angels and demons.

Funny, you current location:

On a bus to Hell

Dosn't seem very consistant. Unless you mean Hell, Michigan.

I don't care what religion you are. If you want to worship a god, several gods, or the lack of a god do it. If not, don't.

I am starting a petition to request Congress to tell us which God we are under. Who will join me?

Saying "under God" In school is not manditory. You won't get expelled from school for refusing to say somehting you don't believe in. So it dosn't matter. Schools are NOT trying to convert your children. Also, Muslims, Jews, and Christians don't believe in different Gods. They believe the same god exists, the main difference is God's will unto them. I.E. What God wants them to do.

I also want to know if we owe this God any other duties other than to "trust in him" as we are advised to do on the nation's coins.

The writting on US currency is there because it's been tradition since the idea of currency was first used in ancient Rome. "In God we trust" Is not nothing more than an aversion to couterfiting.

[FredFlash]

Saying "under God" In school is not manditory. You won't get expelled from school for refusing to say somehting you don't believe in. So it dosn't matter. Schools are NOT trying to convert your children. Also, Muslims, Jews, and Christians don't believe in different Gods. They believe the same god exists, the main difference is God's will unto them. I.E. What God wants them to do.

I hold it firmly that that "God alone is Lord of the conscience." Thus, any attempt by the civil government to influence men's hearts and consciences regarding the obligations and requisitions owed to his Creator - whether that influence or interference be by "reason and persuasion" or "force and violence" - is a sinful "trespass upon the prerogatives of Jehovah."

--Founding Father Jacob Broom Letter to James Abbot dated January 17, 1791

[Muninn]

What the heck made this topic start again after almost two years inactivity?

Fred, if you want to say something worthy that's great but please don't bump really really old topics. It would have been better if you had opened a new topic.

And I think you might find a more responsive audience in the I Read This forums (to which I don't have a link to or visit so you may have posted it there already).

[Rooster]

Does he exist, does he not?

Who the feck cares. I couldn't give a flying one. And frankly, the idea of a God wanting you to worship him through fear of not getting to "heaven" is sickening to me.

If he wants more than for someone to just lead a decent honest life, then sod him, and I'll see you all at the bar in Hell.

My shout.